Time for indoor plant starts?
- Thread starter Markymark
- Start date
GardenForums.com a friendly and growing community of gardeners.
We feature a Garden Discussion Forum and Garden Photo Gallery. It's a fun and friendly place to talk with other gardeners, ask questions, share you knowledge, view and post photos and more! Whether you're a master gardener, or brand new to the hobby, you'll find something of interest here.
After this season I won't have to worry about tomato starts. I'm going to start clipping off parts of it and planting it. That way I know what variety it is, as I have like 6 different cherry tomatoes (different colors). I got a mixed variety of seeds from the seller which is cool but who plants 20 tomatoes for a few people. Would need to have a factory to keep up with the canning. I'm going to plant them all this year just to make sure I get all the colors. But I may just get a couple stacks of pots so I can get all the colors and keep them growing from cuttings for next season.
If you want to see the building of my planter boxes click here, and if you want to see the building of my pergola click here (they are links to Facebook).
If you're willing to baby them a little 6 weeks is about right for peppers and tomatoes I'd say 3 or 4 weeks is about right for squash and similar plants.
I have a traditional last frost date of May 15 so I aim to start my seeds indoors around the middle of Irish History month (March).
While most people think about the light requirements you also need something to agitate the seedlings to prevent them from getting too leggy. Many people use a small oscillating fan directed over the seedlings for this. I have yet to set one of these up so I brush my hand lightly over each plant two or three times a day.
Another thing is label the pots well. I had one year where I "knew" which plants were which and didn't label them too well. I ended up planting 6 jalapeno pepper plants and 2 bell pepper plants when I wanted the reverse. I was able to do this as I always plant more than I want in the final garden and either trade/give the seedlings away to neighbors or just kill them off and use the pot again.
I have a traditional last frost date of May 15 so I aim to start my seeds indoors around the middle of Irish History month (March).
While most people think about the light requirements you also need something to agitate the seedlings to prevent them from getting too leggy. Many people use a small oscillating fan directed over the seedlings for this. I have yet to set one of these up so I brush my hand lightly over each plant two or three times a day.
Another thing is label the pots well. I had one year where I "knew" which plants were which and didn't label them too well. I ended up planting 6 jalapeno pepper plants and 2 bell pepper plants when I wanted the reverse. I was able to do this as I always plant more than I want in the final garden and either trade/give the seedlings away to neighbors or just kill them off and use the pot again.
Oh yes Mark, 6-8 weeks is about right for most things except as noted, cukes and family.
Yep, I used to get "label scramble" frequently till I started to use permanent marker on light-colored seedling pots. I hate when a beefsteak turns out to be a cherry tomato, too late then to do much about it.
Yep, I used to get "label scramble" frequently till I started to use permanent marker on light-colored seedling pots. I hate when a beefsteak turns out to be a cherry tomato, too late then to do much about it.
Last edited:
Markymark
Member
So if you're interested in potless planting here is my setup (just threw it together)
I made 3 frames that hold roughly between 24-30 each. All planted out it has 81 plants (I slowly made the best shape LOL). I had the water to soil off, but I was able to get them made. So I did to 1 cubic feet of potting soil 3 gallons of water, I would maybe cut that down to 2 gallons, and 1.5 gallons at least.
These fit in a 2 foot by 33" area. So pretty good space per plant. These soil blocks you see are made by this (this takes you to an amazon link - BTW I found this on youtube and so far like it). So I used some REALLY cheap potting soil that I wish I didn't. Next time I will be making my own out of coco coir and perlite probably. But they held together well, and once they dry out a bit I read the roots of the plants will hold these cubes together for ya, obviously a bit of water but not enough to break it's shape. That's why a really good water retention type material is best. From my personal online research I've read that using material with little to no nutrients is best for starts (all the energy a start has come from it's seed), because with nutrients comes bacteria etc and this can harm your start, so something with good water retention is best, and then the perlite for ease of root development. These squares measure roughly 2"x2"x2." I'm very happy with it so far, and as many know $40 is kinda pricey, but 81 pots probably wouldn't cost $40, but I still have quite a few starts in addition to start. So it could pay for itself this season, and if not this one definitely the fall planting season.
I made 3 frames that hold roughly between 24-30 each. All planted out it has 81 plants (I slowly made the best shape LOL). I had the water to soil off, but I was able to get them made. So I did to 1 cubic feet of potting soil 3 gallons of water, I would maybe cut that down to 2 gallons, and 1.5 gallons at least.
These fit in a 2 foot by 33" area. So pretty good space per plant. These soil blocks you see are made by this (this takes you to an amazon link - BTW I found this on youtube and so far like it). So I used some REALLY cheap potting soil that I wish I didn't. Next time I will be making my own out of coco coir and perlite probably. But they held together well, and once they dry out a bit I read the roots of the plants will hold these cubes together for ya, obviously a bit of water but not enough to break it's shape. That's why a really good water retention type material is best. From my personal online research I've read that using material with little to no nutrients is best for starts (all the energy a start has come from it's seed), because with nutrients comes bacteria etc and this can harm your start, so something with good water retention is best, and then the perlite for ease of root development. These squares measure roughly 2"x2"x2." I'm very happy with it so far, and as many know $40 is kinda pricey, but 81 pots probably wouldn't cost $40, but I still have quite a few starts in addition to start. So it could pay for itself this season, and if not this one definitely the fall planting season.
Last edited:
Cool!
That is a handy tool!
If you go with coir and perlite you should add something like well aged manure and or compost to help as a binder to hold the coir and perlite together.
That is a handy tool!
If you go with coir and perlite you should add something like well aged manure and or compost to help as a binder to hold the coir and perlite together.
Markymark
Member
I used the cheapo walmart potting soil $2.77 a bag (full of sticks, not just small stuff big stuff that wouldn't fit through a ½" classifier!), well I was reading to avoid compost and manure, or if I do use it use a very small amount only for starters, I am not suggesting that anyone is starting them wrong, I just want the highest possible germination ratio and taking out bacteria just makes sense to me, because there is always gonna be good and bad things in compost or manure (even aged properly stuff). Those little blocks go directly into soil and they should have "no" transplant shock, and the roots shouldn't grow into the other blocks due to "air" pruning. But look at the space it gives me compared to potting plants etc. I built the trays for when it's time to take them outside, I'm gonna grab a tray and just take them straight outside. Look how easy it was to mark them as well, bit of masking tape and a marker and easy yet cheap solution.
BTW: my beds are filled with compost, coco coir, horse manure (2 years old), and peat moss. But more so with compost now, I'm gonna be refilling my beds only with compost from here on out (that is why I am not terrible worried about providing nutrients to the starters as my beds are filled with what they need to get huge).
BTW: my beds are filled with compost, coco coir, horse manure (2 years old), and peat moss. But more so with compost now, I'm gonna be refilling my beds only with compost from here on out (that is why I am not terrible worried about providing nutrients to the starters as my beds are filled with what they need to get huge).
Last edited:
I like the idea of soil blockers but they're a little rich for my blood right now. Last season I rolled up newspaper and crimped the bottom closed for my seedling pots. I have tried the peat pots but they fail to break down - last spring I ran across a few that could be no newer than three years old while planting a blueberry bush.
Did you try sifting the mix to remove the larger sticks and bits? If you position two layers of that hardware cloth correctly you would have a quick 1/4" mesh to sift through.
Did you try sifting the mix to remove the larger sticks and bits? If you position two layers of that hardware cloth correctly you would have a quick 1/4" mesh to sift through.
Markymark
Member
I agree it is a bit rich for my blood, but if I bought my starters it would be near 200 plants so it does pay for itself if I choose the option of purchasing the plants. But the part of no transplant shock is pretty important too me as I personally wanna max out production. I should have grabbed out a classifier as I like gold panning and have them on hand LOL! I was thinking of building another bed for my potatoes and I got me some raspberries to plant this season so I wanna isolate them to their own bed as they can be invasive (I think), the guy I follow has them in partial shade and they do good, so tell me what you think.
Last edited:
raspberries can go crazy. They'll both send out runners which pop up all over the place and will set roots were the canes arc down and touch the soil. I have mine in partial shade between my garage and a 6' tall shadow box fence. The partial shade ones will get leggy and I have some going over the fence and touching down in the neighbor's yard. A lawn mower will keep them in check - at least that is what I have read, my garage foundation keeps them in check. I don't know where you are in terms of sun strength. What I read about brambles is they like full sun but will produce to a lesser extent in part shade; this is info from books geared to the midwest though and the sun is a lot more abusive in the south.
I don't really understand what the rendering is of in your post. Is that box to hold trash cans?
I don't really understand what the rendering is of in your post. Is that box to hold trash cans?
Looking good Mark! I wish I had as much time as you in the yard and garden. Won't be long I will be able to get an hour in the evenings after work. 
Markymark
Member
So if you look at the image below this is what I was imagining the trash can part was for...
I wanted to Isolate the raspberries (because I knew they are invasive) to a location where it couldn't get in the way of the potatoes. But I wanted something in the front yard that would look GOOD, but at the same time allow me to grow the potatoes in a nice spot. That area I am using is in my front yard against the fence, so the fence would contain the raspberries a bit and I could wrap a wire around the front of them to keep them growing vertical instead of horizontal. But at the same time I wanna plant some blue potatoes cause the color is just so cool. So in this image you can see the chicken wire, with this technique you allow the potato greens to grow up about a foot over the soil, and then you add more, and you repeat this step until you reach the top of my potato container, I had the circular holes so you can toss dirt in as needed, and the cabinet doors is for harvesting. When the potatoes are ready to be harvested you just dump over the chicken wire and untie them and now there is no digging for potatoes and it just makes it easy to grab them. Now the reason I posted the picture to get commends, I was trying to decide if I should make some of the can visible as I was thinking the potatoes may not get enough sun, so I may not make a back for it, so the potatoes would get afternoon and morning sun.
BTW: I'm 26 years old with no kids and am a hobbyist, free time goes to such things. Plus I would like to think I'm investing in the house (I don't ever plan on selling it as it's my family home). So one should be able to understand why I have so much free time haha!
I wanted to Isolate the raspberries (because I knew they are invasive) to a location where it couldn't get in the way of the potatoes. But I wanted something in the front yard that would look GOOD, but at the same time allow me to grow the potatoes in a nice spot. That area I am using is in my front yard against the fence, so the fence would contain the raspberries a bit and I could wrap a wire around the front of them to keep them growing vertical instead of horizontal. But at the same time I wanna plant some blue potatoes cause the color is just so cool. So in this image you can see the chicken wire, with this technique you allow the potato greens to grow up about a foot over the soil, and then you add more, and you repeat this step until you reach the top of my potato container, I had the circular holes so you can toss dirt in as needed, and the cabinet doors is for harvesting. When the potatoes are ready to be harvested you just dump over the chicken wire and untie them and now there is no digging for potatoes and it just makes it easy to grab them. Now the reason I posted the picture to get commends, I was trying to decide if I should make some of the can visible as I was thinking the potatoes may not get enough sun, so I may not make a back for it, so the potatoes would get afternoon and morning sun.
BTW: I'm 26 years old with no kids and am a hobbyist, free time goes to such things. Plus I would like to think I'm investing in the house (I don't ever plan on selling it as it's my family home). So one should be able to understand why I have so much free time haha!
Last edited:
Oh the potato tower. I have chased this for two seasons and only have one more season worth of patients before I write this off as an urban legend.
Try looking up the Kenosha Potato Project.
I have tried Pontiac Red and German Butter Ball and both failed to set more than regular planting. This year I will try some fingerling like Russian Banana. The fingerlings are supposed to set higher than other types. Modern cultivators have been bred for uniform size and depth for mechanical harvesting. If you want a blue I have read about McIntyre Blue and Blue Finn being a good choice.
The only thing I see with the beds like that is some varieties of potatoes get big above ground and the berry canes can get big. You may have trouble cleaning out the potato vines when they interlace with the berries.
A bed like the potato bed should allow you to remove the soil and rotate the soil through instead of the plants through. I'm sure you read about how everything seems to attack potatoes and tomatoes and the need to rotate. Just think about what late blight did to the Irish in the 1840's.
Rather than chicken wire and potentially filling the whole box think about using a 30 gallon trash can or a 55 gallon drum.
I have been doing a stacked 2x10 system like blogged about here.
Try looking up the Kenosha Potato Project.
I have tried Pontiac Red and German Butter Ball and both failed to set more than regular planting. This year I will try some fingerling like Russian Banana. The fingerlings are supposed to set higher than other types. Modern cultivators have been bred for uniform size and depth for mechanical harvesting. If you want a blue I have read about McIntyre Blue and Blue Finn being a good choice.
The only thing I see with the beds like that is some varieties of potatoes get big above ground and the berry canes can get big. You may have trouble cleaning out the potato vines when they interlace with the berries.
A bed like the potato bed should allow you to remove the soil and rotate the soil through instead of the plants through. I'm sure you read about how everything seems to attack potatoes and tomatoes and the need to rotate. Just think about what late blight did to the Irish in the 1840's.
Rather than chicken wire and potentially filling the whole box think about using a 30 gallon trash can or a 55 gallon drum.
I have been doing a stacked 2x10 system like blogged about here.
Markymark
Member
It seems like an expensive way to grow potatoes as compared to using something like chicken wire. I mean you could go through a 2x4 per level. But I like the way it looks compared to chicken wire. It would also allow me to avoid building the trash bin type look. I think a cheaper alternative is to use dog eared boards that are 1 inch thick by 6 inch wide or maybe some osb cut to size. I think the cedar or redwood boards would look best for a front yard location. I'm gonna be buying wood soon to make a 2200 gallon fish tank so it may be a project for later. I'm gonna think about it as I wanna start growing near all I buy.
Last edited:
2200 gallon fish tank? Breaking into aquaculture?
The 2x6's I use were scraps and didn't cost anything out of pocket. Standard grade pine has lasted several seasons for me. In the long run the OSB will get more expensive unless it is scrap and free out-of-pocket. I find that the OSB is one season and done. I don't think you will have a problem with the dog-ear redwood if you keep a nice light weight mix. You have a hidden cost with the chicken wire method as you will have to dump a ton of water on it over a season.
I'm only about 5 years beyond you. I started my garden at 25/26 with no kids. Now I'm 29 with a wife, one kid, and another on the way. The first few years of a garden can take a lot of work but after a few seasons you learn some time savers that work for you. Garden time saving tips may make for a good thread. I'd be surprised if one is not started already after thinking about it for ten seconds.
The 2x6's I use were scraps and didn't cost anything out of pocket. Standard grade pine has lasted several seasons for me. In the long run the OSB will get more expensive unless it is scrap and free out-of-pocket. I find that the OSB is one season and done. I don't think you will have a problem with the dog-ear redwood if you keep a nice light weight mix. You have a hidden cost with the chicken wire method as you will have to dump a ton of water on it over a season.
I'm only about 5 years beyond you. I started my garden at 25/26 with no kids. Now I'm 29 with a wife, one kid, and another on the way. The first few years of a garden can take a lot of work but after a few seasons you learn some time savers that work for you. Garden time saving tips may make for a good thread. I'd be surprised if one is not started already after thinking about it for ten seconds.
Markymark
Member
Yeah, I'm getting into aquaponics, I originally wanted to see if I can make a business out of it, but after reading a bit into it, doesn't seem very viable. But it's not like the extra produce I have I can't take it down to the farmers markets, we got several around here within 20 minutes of my house. I'm growing the worlds hottest pepper right now, I'm wondering if I can sell them for like $1 each as a novelty type food. I don't know many people who have the guts to toss one of those in they mouth. The plant has sprouted for me on a heating mat just fine.
Also we don't have water meters here, we pay same price regardless on the amount of water so far. I never considered the evaporation properties of the chicken wire. I will probably build the potato bins as it is just aesthetically nice looking depending on the wood used, and I was thinking the potato greens doesn't look half bad. Too be honest once everything is going I didn't really spend tons of times working in the garden. I have very little weeds in there as I didn't reuse my dirt around the house, so seeds popping up are from birds and or when the grass gets cut and throw into the bed. I spend most of my time prepping for the season.
Also we don't have water meters here, we pay same price regardless on the amount of water so far. I never considered the evaporation properties of the chicken wire. I will probably build the potato bins as it is just aesthetically nice looking depending on the wood used, and I was thinking the potato greens doesn't look half bad. Too be honest once everything is going I didn't really spend tons of times working in the garden. I have very little weeds in there as I didn't reuse my dirt around the house, so seeds popping up are from birds and or when the grass gets cut and throw into the bed. I spend most of my time prepping for the season.
Last edited:
klevelyn
New Member
You have a very nice setup. Here in Utah we are still in winter mode. My Father in Bakersfield Calif is starting to plant his tomatoes. It must be nice to have a year round garden.
I just started my cabbage and broccoli etc. Will be starting peppers and tomatoes next month. Starting your own plants is well worth the effort. You can plant what varieties you want.
I just started my cabbage and broccoli etc. Will be starting peppers and tomatoes next month. Starting your own plants is well worth the effort. You can plant what varieties you want.
Markymark
Member
After this season I won't have to worry about tomato starts. I'm going to start clipping off parts of it and planting it. That way I know what variety it is, as I have like 6 different cherry tomatoes (different colors). I got a mixed variety of seeds from the seller which is cool but who plants 20 tomatoes for a few people. Would need to have a factory to keep up with the canning. I'm going to plant them all this year just to make sure I get all the colors. But I may just get a couple stacks of pots so I can get all the colors and keep them growing from cuttings for next season.
If you want to see the building of my planter boxes click here, and if you want to see the building of my pergola click here (they are links to Facebook).
Last edited:
Gardenforums.com is a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for sites to earn advertising fees by advertising and linking to amazon.com